Come fai?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dc2Z7CL4Cv0

Hey bud. I'll say this much for you: Your convictions speak volumes about your character. I may never have the same beliefs as you do, but I honestly believe you are a good and decent man. And that itself is a rare enough thing in this world today. If religion works for you, then it's a good thing.
It's only a bad thing with people who use it to suit their own ends/ambitions. Make sense?
Don't be a stranger in the forums. I may be a beer swilling 'sinner', but you'll always be OK in my book.

Hey, never really talked to you before, but I was floating through peoples profiles and came across yours. Read a lot of your stuff and it's good to see someone with faith using NT. Good stuff in your shout box, nice to see openly religious people (especially in these parts lol)

I forgot to mention this:
"And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him".
Hebrews 11-6

All the sins I have.. God made me do it., because god made everything, didn't he?
http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/

So your a bible beater huh? How about this then, help me out. When I was growing up I was taught Santa Clause, Easter Bunny, Tooth Fairy and God were all real. But one by one I learned Santa Clause, Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy weren't real. Then I'm supposed to belive God is?? Understand I'm not trying to push your buttons and piss you off I just don't understand how people expect others to belive. You got my word I'll read what you write and try my best to understand it. Thanks, Jason

I notice your a big time religon guy, I used to be a proud protestant a few years ago, and I just lost my faith overnite.
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I am more of a scientist kinda thinker, not a scientology believer, but I don't believe in the god that christainity believes in, til I have a word with the big guy, I will have my options open to practical thinking....

Why thank you.
Yeah, I do quite a bit of reading on that subject. Pretty much daily. Glad you like it.
Take it easy.

Hi fanatic, been awhile since I've seen you around. Wow, I see you've got a very interesting debate going on here. As someone else already mentioned, I truly admire your convictions and your unshakable stance in your beliefs. But I would have to agree with Varholy, religion is the biggest con game ever perpetrated on mankind, it's a man-made thing, conceived by mortals who lived and died, just like we do in modern times. It has always been a means for power hungry madman to control the masses through fear. I do not doubt the existense of a 'creator' (God, creative force, however you choose to look at it) because hey, this universe didn't create itself. But I don't believe there is anyone on the face of this entire earth who can comprehend who, or what God (the creative force) is. How could they? Sure, certain people have claimed to have visions, but how could they possibly know they're authentic? I've seen what I truly believed was a ghost, and a UFO, but people have laughed at me about it. Yet people will automatically accept the claims of a 'religious experience'?
I've no doubt that religion is a good thing, for people who truly have a strong sense of morals and want to live their life doing the right thing. But the majority of folks (if they would admit it) would tell you they go to church, and they got saved because they wanted to go to heaven, instead of hell. See what's wrong with this picture? Would a loving, 'biblical' God rule through fear?
I could go on all day about this, but I'll sum it up this way, these are my beliefs: We are all born with free will, for a reason. It's up to us to make our own way through life, and make decisions for ourselves, not rely on a two-thousand year old text telling us how to live our lives. (iDoSay made some very interesting points, btw) I do believe that our souls do live on, and I also believe in karma. We reap what we sow. If you're a miserable S.O.B in this life, you'll still be a miserable S.O.B whereever you end up after you leave this plane of existense. And vice-versa for a 'good', decent person. It's up to us to become the best person we can be, and no one else.

by fanatic-777, April 20 2008 : 9:29pm
Here is proof that Heaven and Hell are real, that God exists and that Jesus Christ is His Son:
.http://www.spiritlessons.com/
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And http://bibleprobe.com/nde.htm
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. People, please read this. It's going to be brief this time
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All you have to do is acknowledge you are a sinner, repent (turn away from) your sins and make Jesus the Lord of your life and you will meet God in Heaven once you die.
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By turning away from every kind of sin, humans become perfect, sinless and frees themselves from evil. Only through Jesus can this be done. Think about it, atheism, philosophies of life, islam, all those things NEVER have and NEVER will enable one to become perfect, entirely sinless, untouched by any kind of evil.
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Have genuine faith in Him, call on Him when you're having difficulties & be thankful when He provides for you and He will bless your life.
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And remember, God says in the Bible "If you seek me with all your heart, you will find me",Deuteronomy 4:29. When you seek Him there must be not a single shadow of doubt in your heart, but joyful expectation about what is to come.
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I think I've said it all. God bless you all.

Hey, thanks for taking the time to watch those videos, I really didn't expect them to change your faith. I just wanted you to see them... and, I don't know why to be honest.
I could spend an hour or so countering everything you just said about creation, DNA, evolution being "just a theory" etc, but I suspect you already know the true definition of a theory in the scientific sense of the term, and the arguments I could type here regarding your other points are covered in those links.
The thing is I don't want to come across as a pushy atheist. I'm just glad you took the time to watch those clips. I'll do the same with the clips you linked. Thanks for taking the time to make an intelligent response. Don't stop searching for answers

Hi Umbrageous, good to meet you.
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Why do you doubt NDEs ? No reasonable Christian would dare lie about the afterlife for fear of punishment... Anyway check this out http://www.near-death.com/experiences/evidence03.html. Science still has no answer as to why a blind person can see his body and surroundings at the time of an NDE and claims to see Jesus.
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My faith in the Lord will remain the same, for no scientific theory can tell me my experience with God is not valid. I have gathered evidence there is a Hell and Heaven, that Jesus exists as Son of God but I mostly rely on faith. However, I'll still answer the points made on those youtube vids.
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You know I can't watch all of them, so if there's a point you want me to make about a particular subject, tell me, but before I just need to say that science is not infallible, as this link proves: http://www.physorg.com/news127499715.html If science can make a mistake on this subject, (and it's matter of the utmost importance, because that asteroid is a serious threat to humanity) I'm sure there are hundreds of mistakes more and approximations that remain hidden. Some people put a blind faith in science and some of it's mistakes and are deceived. I advise you not to put blind and unsceptical faith in science.
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1) Creation & Evolution The Bible states that man was created in the image of God. So every human feature, like the human skull was created in the image of God. Just look at the skull of the cro-magnon homo sapiens who lived (according to science) 30 000 years ago http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_Homo_sapiens That skull is not a human skull and thus is not in God's image. Therefore what are called "homo-sapiens" were not human, and the same goes for his predecessors (Neanderthal, etc).The Bible does not recognise them as humans, so the history of those beings is rather irrelevant to me and does not contradict biblical creation.
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This washes aside all theories of evolution, that have obvious flaws anyway: like in one of the vids there's talk about a "missing link". Anyway there is no scientific proof for evolution, it's just a theory.
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2)Case of DNA-The presentator blames God, but all sickness comes from the Devil.This guy seriously needs to read the Bible before making dumb claims like that. The devil is the author of sickness and Jesus came in the past to destroy his works. The difformities here caused by DNA are a corruption of God's creation. And where does all evil, every corruption come from ? From the devil, it's common sense really. I could go on for ages on that subject, add Bible quotes but it would take for ever.
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3) Origin of life The presentator says DNA was made from components from the ground whereas the Bible says God created man out of dust."And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul". It's the same thing, the only difference is that science leaves God out of the equation
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4)Creation & Age of the world: There are many different interpretations of the relevant Bible scripture,the 7days could be literal or metaphorical. It's possible in a literal interpretation that a day in that time lasted much longer that 24hours, with the garden of Eden being a bit like the eternal Heavens. Otherwise science can't say anything against the metaphorical interpretation.
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5)What every creationist must deny (cdk007) The presentator has it wrong. I don't think he actually makes any sense. He says "creationists think they can deny evolution but happily accept the rest science has to offer. Most own computers (...), use an electronic device. However if you deny evolution you must deny all the following: logic, human reason scientific method"
Science has been able to prove that when you light paper on fire, it is consumed. All one has to do is take a lighter, do it and they've proven it. But nobody can do the same thing for the theory of evolution.
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Lastly you talk about following God like it's something unpleasant for Christians (most atheists share this misconception). That's not the case at all. It's with a joyful and faithful heart that those who know Him follow Him.
Maybe you'll have time to see this: http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=...q=%2223+minutes +in+Hell%22&total=134&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=sea rch&plindex=0&hl=en-GB

Hi, I can never even hope to convert someone who needs to believe in the supernatural, doesn't stop me trying though, and I don't want to be drawn into a debate about "near death experiences" and the like..it really is folly.However I do hate to see the propagation of religion in our supposedly enlightened times. People living in hope of an after life are wasting this short, wonderful, vital existance in my opinion. Do yourself a favour, and watch this Youtube users videos
http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=potholer54&p=r
He describes the wonders of the universe much more eloquently than I ever could. He also explains how it can all be attributed to natural forces and debunks some Christian ideas about creation etc. If this isn't enough (and please DO watch them..they are awe inspiring) then I also recommend the following users channels;
http://www.youtube.com/user/cdk007?ob=1
http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=Thunderf00t&p=r
http://www.youtube.com/user/RabidApe
Don't take these people's versions of the Universe as "gospel" But think for yourself. If you can counter anything in those videos with solid observable evidence then you can step up and claim a Nobel Prize, because you would be the first to do so in the history of humankind. Sorry to preach, I'm just trying to save your soul And I don't think "respecting another's beliefs" extends to placing them beyond criticism and rational analysis.

Here is proof that Heaven and Hell are real, that God exists and that Jesus Christ is His Son: http://www.spiritlessons.com/